Wednesday, October 14, 2015
Phony Adults
One of the most memorable things about Catcher in the Rye is how
Holden classifies most adults as "phony." Why does he do this? What
does he mean, and why is the idea of being "phony" or "not phony"
important to Holden's story? What does it say about Holden's
psychological state that he sees people in these terms? Use some scenes
or details from the book to illustrate what you mean (for instance, the
scene with Sally, or the scene with the girls in the bar, etc.)
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In “The Catcher in the Rye” by J.D. Salinger, Holden describes adults as phonies or not phonies. I believe he does this partly because he does not understand where most adults come from. Also, Holden seems to think that adults act like they are much wiser than kids his age, which seems to anger him throughout the book. The idea of being “phony” and “not phony” is important to Holden’s background because it explains to us and gives the audience an idea that he does not see many people as loyal and kind, but something might have happened to turn his opinion towards everyone around him. This also might give us insight to Holden’s relationships with adults and that an incident might have occurred in his past with a close adult that caused his mind to flip, not wanting anything to do with them. This also shows Holden in a very negative psychological state because even if he does have a compliment about someone, he always seems to follow it with a flaw that they have as well. I believe the scene when him and Jane almost “necked” contributes to his pessimistic views towards adult figures because he seemed very disgusted with her step father and his behavior to Jane and his normal living techniques. He also explains that the step dad looked like someone that would only talk to you when they needed something. This explains to the reader that right away he can usually detect something off about people and that he always jumps to a low conclusion of what he thinks that person is like.
ReplyDeleteHolden from "The Catcher in the Rye" by J.D. Salinger, sees must adults as being "phony ". He see them that way because he believes that they lost some sort of element of innocence or they care about things that Holden sees as "phony". For example Holden thinks of his brother as being "phony". He thinks of his brother this way because to Holden his brother sold out, he was a great writer but now he writes what people want him to write, and lost an element of himself that made him different. I think the idea of "phony" or "not phony is so important to Holden because to him the worst thing you can be is "phony". The worst thing you can do is have a regular job, family and only care about what car you are getting next, and how hard you will have to work at getting that next promotion at work. Being stable and caring about those "phony" elements of life is what scares Holden the most, that one day he will be that man only caring about what sports car he gets next or getting the next promotion. This is why Holden spends so much of his time worrying wither or not he is being "phony". Holden i think is scared of stability, that's why he is breaking down more and more in the book because he mutated social norms that adults have to face and now see's them as "phony", and through out the book he is forced to grow up more. He is being forced to in his mind be "phony". This is why he explodes at Sally because he thinks of this grand plan, that will stop him from having to grow up, and become "phony", but when Sally rejects his plan, reality and Holden's fear come crashing down on him. Holden has deep abstract thoughts, he is scared that he will lose that part of himself that thinks deeper about things when he grows up like his brother D.B, and he will slowly just become the phony man he is so scared of being.
ReplyDeleteI believe Holden calls people phonies because he’s trying to seem above them and show how great he is. He always sees someone who seems to be more successful than him and calls them phonies. He’s more of a phony than everyone he calls that. I think Holden realizes how much he, in his own eyes, failed in life. He says how he can’t hold a real relationship, he’s failing in school, he lies all the time, and much more. An example of Holden’s phoniness is when he says he is good friends with Mrs. Morrow’s son. That was completely phony, he lied right to her face. Overall he cannot hold a stable life. I think he uses the term to cover up his own ways by putting other people down. I think it’s important to Holden to not be a phony. He misses the innocence of people that’s why I think he looks up to Phoebe, because he still sees her innocence and how she’s not a phony. I think Holden has mentally lost his innocence and can’t cope with it so he attacks everyone else with the term.
ReplyDeleteHolden uses the word phony to describe many things in “Catcher in the Rye”, whether it be adults, or just anyone in general. Personally I feel like he’s using the word because he doesn’t know what else to call people. Holden could be saying phony for the sole purpose of making the reader interpret what it means in the context. With how much he says phony, it’s much like the situation in the hotel where Holden keeps calling everyone (especially girls) crumby. He uses the word too much and leaves it there to interpret, it’s the same case with the word phony. Another scene is when Holden is home, and wakes Phoebe up. Phoebe realizes that Holden failed out of Pencey, and Holden explains what Pencey was like. While explaining it though, he uses the word phony a few times, and each time is a different context. “Even the couple of nice teachers on faculty, they were phonies too.” (Salinger, 168) and “...give them a lot of phony advice...” (Salinger, 169), here Holden uses the word phony in different context to leave it for the reader to interpret. This is why I think think Holden says the word phony too much.
ReplyDeleteI think what Holden means by phony is someone he does not trust. He does not trust these people because her thinks that they are lying with the way they act. What I mean by that is the way Holden thinks is if someone who is an adult is acting too nice to you they are acting phony. With kids though it is different to Holden since kids do not know how to be phony, the are innocent. Holden is an extreme pessimist which is why he never thinks someone (who is not a kid) is being nice is just being nice and not trying to get something from you. For example when Holden goes out to watch Ernie play the piano he constantly says that he’s such a phony for whenever he takes a bow. Holden thinks that he is just trying to show off which makes him a phony. This would also explain why Holden always call his brother a phony since he is in Hollywood and acts differently because of that.
ReplyDeleteIn the novel The Catcher in the Rye by J.D. Salinger, the main character Holden is very set on the idea that most adults are “phonies”. It seems as though his definition of being a phony is someone who fakes their emotions, those who go along with the crowd and don’t seem to be their own person. Holden is obviously not like most people and the way he talks about himself and life in general suggests that he thinks the same thing. The reason why he is so hellbent on not being a phony is because in his mind, almost all of the people that he has gotten close to or that he loves has become a phony in some way, so he doesn’t want to become like them. For example, he thought his former girlfriend Sally was a phony because she wouldn’t move to Vermont with him and live his fantasy, when in reality she was simply being logical about the idea. Also, he believes that his brother D. B. is one of the biggest phonies of them all because he moved to Hollywood to become a screenwriter. The fact that Holden thinks almost everyone he encounters is phony and does not stop to think about himself becoming one also says a lot about his mental state, and it can also be very irritating. What he doesn’t realise is that not everyone is a phony; like his brother for example, he is simply just doing what he loves, and Holden has no right to judge him for that. It’s very clear that Holden needs help or at least someone to talk to, because if he lives his whole life with a negative attitude towards everyone and everything, it will not end well for him.
ReplyDeleteIn many scenes of “The Catcher in the Rye”, by J.D. Salinger, Holden Caulfield calls most adults “phony.” Holden does this because he believes that the adults he encountered throughout his life don’t show their true personalities. Holden does this to kind of prove to himself that adults don’t act genuinely or with honest. I believe it’s important to Holden because he looks for ways to criticize people, and knowing that they don’t act genuinely makes Holden feel better about himself. For example, when Holden was on a date with Sally, he encountered one of her friends, George, outside of the Lunts show. As Sally and George were having a conversation, Holden kept talking about how “phony” he was. On page 127, Holden thinks to himself, “He was the kind of phony that had to give themselves room when they answered somebody’s questions...they probably met each other just once, at some phony party.” Holden is judging George before he even knows him, saying he’s “phony” because he sounds like one. As you can see from this quote, Holden is criticizing George based on how he acts, talks, moves, etc. He sees everyone as having a bad side, and he calls them “phony” because they don’t show it around others. Overall, Holden needs help, or atleast somebody to talk to about his problems, because his psychological state isn’t in good shape if he looks at everyone with such negativity.
ReplyDeleteIn “The Catcher in the Rye” Holden classifies most adults as “phony”. He does this because he thinks that all of the so called “phonies” have changed who they really are. He thinks they are phonies if they were changed by the world and community around them. Holden thinks that there are very few people who have not changed yet, he treasures them and calls them “pure”. He think almost everyone he meets is a phony and he despises them for it. His physiological state must be really paranoid, for him to think everyone except him and a select few are phoney. The only group of people Holden does not think are phonies are children. The children have not been changed yet by the rest of the world so he calls them pure. Holden's scene with Old Sally shows you how he thinks about everyone. He gets mad at her when she says she wont go away with him. I think he gets mad about this because he believes that Sally is turning into a phony too and he doesn’t want that to happen to someone he loves.
ReplyDeleteIn “The Catcher in the Rye” by J.D. Salinger, Holden, the protagonist, has a strange obsession with the word “phony”. Holden uses this word over and over, typically using it to describe adults. He calls people phony for many reasons, but above all, he will call someone phony if they do and say opposite things, or if they say or do something he doesn’t like. For example, on page 100, Holden says, (talking about ministers), “They sound so phony when they talk.” In this quote, Holden is describing how ministers talk in such a phony way, when they should just talk in their normal voice. Holden’s use of the term phony is very important to his ideology, as it dictates who he will socialize with. People who he considers to be phony typically he does not continue to talk with. While on the other hand, the few people he doesn’t call phony are the few people he will socialize with multiple times, and for longer periods of time. Some characters who he does not consider include Phoebe, Jane and Sally. With this in mind, Holden will often hold women to a higher standard, like a military veteran holding people in the military to a higher standard of integrity. Considering Holden’s obsession with the word, he likely suffers from OCD (overly compulsive disorder). OCD is a rather common mental health issue in which the sufferer may have recurring thoughts, and, often will act upon these thoughts. Holden expresses this since he uses phony over and over again.
ReplyDeleteIn “ the Catcher in the Rye” Holden often calls people “phonies” or in-genuine. I believe he does this to cover up his own insecurities about himself. He calls people phonies to make himself feel better because he believes that if he finds the flaws in every one else then he will seem much better in comparison. For instance, Holden is in some ways unwilling to grow up. He likes the simpleness and innocence of being young, and doesn't want to mature. He is afraid of the adult world because it is complex and you are faced with real problems that are not easily fixed. So I feel like it is a form of protection for him to just call the adult world full of phonies. It is easy for him to feel good about not maturing if in his head he believes all adults to be phonies. For example, when he had Sunny the prostitute come to his room, he was planning on having sex with her. He really does not understand sex or why people can have it with people they do not truly love. In an attempt to be like most people he invites in Sunny. But after she arrives he does not want to have sex, but instead just wants to talk. He actually forces her to get off of him, and makes up excuses, like saying he is not in the mood. This could be another sign of his unwillingness to grow up,but instead just resort back to trying to preserve his innocence. It is clear Holden has a problem if he views people who have simply grown up, and matured as “phonies”. That is not even logical, but Holden has it in his head that it is the truth because it makes him feel better for how he is now, and what he’s done in the past.
ReplyDeleteHolden calls almost everyone he meets a “phony” in the book. This I think is because he does not have or know any other word to describe them. He uses this word just to describe someone who he does not understand or dislikes. I think that he prejudges people and uses the word “phony” as a way to describe them because he can not figure out what else to say. For example, when he is on his date with Sally and he does not like the play, he calls all of the people standing there and talking about the play phonies. He does not like that so many people like something he does not. “You never saw so many phonies in all your life, everybody smoking their ears off and talking about the play so that everybody could hear and know how sharp they were." After this Sally meets someone that she knows and she says hello to him. “You should've seen the way they said hello. You'd have thought they hadn't seen each other in twenty years. The funny part was, they probably met each other just once, at some phony party.” At this moment Holden seems jealous. He is on a date with Sally and she is spending time talking to this other guy. He calls the party phony because he does not like the fact that he does not know how or why they know each other. Holden says so many things like this about people he does not like. Thinking back to the women at the bar, he does not like them very much and calls them phonies. Holden cannot bring himself to say that he does not like someone or does not know them, so instead he calls them "phony".
ReplyDeleteThroughout the book “ The Catcher in the Rye “ Holden describes many characters by calling them phonies. Phony is a word that Holden uses to refer to many adult characters. I believe that Holden does not want to grow up and become and adult. He sees all the problems with becoming an adult, and how to become successful as an adult in his view it is to become a phony. For instance, Holden’s brother is a writer and he now writes movies for Hollywood. Holden used to love his brothers writing, but after he “sold himself out” to Hollywood Holden began referring to him as a phony. Holden’s brother had become a successful adult and in Holden’s perspective that made him a phony. Holden’s views on other people stop him from having a successful life. Holden sees almost every character he meets as a phony, but he never thinks that he himself is a phony. I feel Holden’s brother Allie plays a big part in why he thinks of so many people as phonies. Holden’s brother Allie died when he was 11 his death impacted Holden in many ways. I feel that Holden saw his little brother Allie as pure and not affected by adulthood and compares him to the adults that he meets and calls phonies. Holden’s life has been full of failure and when he sees success in peoples lives he doesn’t try to come up with a reason other than they are a phony. Holden needs someone to talk to about his emotions and he needs to start looking at the bright side of people not just the negative.
ReplyDeleteIn the book “the Catcher in the Rye” Holden is obsessed with calling adults phonies. He calles people phonies because he does not want to grow up and become one. This is shown during the scene with Sally at the restaurant. During this scene, he says “No, there wouldn’t be marvelous places to go to after I went to college and all… You don’t see what I mean” page 133. During this quote he talks about himself doing all of the things he believes are phony. He states that he will end up doing these things after college which shows he believes he will become a phony. The idea of “phony” or “not phony” is important to Holden’s story because it is one reason why he has put his life on hold and stopped trying in college. He believes the longer he stays in college, the longer it will take him to become a phony. Holden also does not seem to understand phonies which may make him wonder how he could ever become one. The idea of people being phonies shows that Holden is still a lot like a kid because calling someone phony seems to be something only a child would say. This idea also shows the negativity that he has in his life. Because he is always calling people phonies, he does not have much time to reflect on the good parts of people. He only talks about a few people in good ways and this happens only if he really likes them. Overall, Holden does not want to end up like a phony.
ReplyDeleteIn the “Catcher in the Rye”, Holden classifies many adults as “phonies”. This might be because Holden doesn't really know how to express his emotions in a proper manner or he just does not care about people in general. In the story, Holen was talking about this man named Ossenburger and he said “I can just see the big phony bastard shifting into first gear and just asking Jesus to send him a few more stiffs.” I think he used the word phony to express his feelings toward the human kind. He feels that everything is a joke or fake and does not feel like there are any real people. He never talks about the positive side in situations or people. All he does is make fun of others and often times, himself as well. He also calls Ackley a phony. This was rude of Holden because clearly he knows something is wrong with Ackley's thinking process so he really should not be making fun of him. I am sure all of the other kids at the schools he used to go to thought the same thing about Holden. He does not care about other people's feelings. This might be a jealousy feeling Holden has. Although it might not be jealousy toward Ackley but he might be jealous of everyone else he calls a phony. Holden might not want to say what he really feels. He might also be scared of what others think of him so he thinks badly towards other people.
ReplyDeleteThroughout the story “the Catcher in the Rye”, Holden uses the word “phony” or “phonies” many times to describe adults. As Jill stated above, “This might be because Holden doesn't really know how to express his emotions in a proper manner or he just does not care about people in general.” Holden still seems to struggle with the whole “growing up” stage, and going off on his own. He just doesn't want to grow up. When he refers to adults as “phonies” it's describing how he feels about growing up, as a way to show his feelings. That's just why he dislikes humans. Because they grow up. Also, he doesn't get out a lot to communicate with others. Calling them phonies may be some way to not have people want to communicate with him. Then again, he really only communicates with Jane and he’ll talk to and other girls, like Sally or Phoebe. He finds girls pure and innocent, along with kids or teenagers. He wants to stay a kid, and stay innocent and not become a “phony”. But, the people that he calls phonies are adults, and mostly guys. On page 100 in the book, Holden starts explaining religion. He was saying his parent’s religion, the children in their families’ religion. After he then states how he dislikes ministers, and how they “sound phony when they talk.” Ministers speak about church stuff, including sermons. I can tell Holden doesn't like sermons because they are long, and “grown up”.
ReplyDeleteIn “The Catcher in the Rye” written by J. D. Salinger, Holden Caulfield refers to many adults as “phony”. Holden may think this way because he sees growing into an adult will change who he really is. The adults he calls phonies had typically changed something about themselves to either impress someone else, or to just fit in with the rest of the community. An example of this is found early in the book when Holden says that "one of the biggest reasons I left Elkton Hills was because I was surrounded by phonies" (Salinger 13). He goes on to talk about how Haas was one of the biggest phonies there because of they way he presented himself in public. The way that Haas communicated and interacted with others seemed foreign to Holden because that side of Haas didn't reflect in any way on Holden. Holden couldn't see himself growing into that kind of a person when he finally became an adult because it all looked fake to him. Later on, Holden doesn't realize when he makes himself a phony when he is speaking with the mother of an old classmate at Pencey Prep on the train. He becomes the phony when he changes part of himself just to succeed in having a pleasant but unwanted conversation with the woman. He is the phony once he expresses that he is not very fond of her son and when he gives her a fake name. He changed his public appearance at that moment to impress the woman with a nice conversation. Whenever Holden calls another person a phony, it strengthens the idea that he is not ready to grow up and face adult responsibilities in the real world. By calling these people phonies, he is able to believe that remaining a kid is better than becoming an adult. Holden's psychological state must be in bad shape if he always categorizes people as phony and refuses to grow up.
ReplyDeleteThroughout “The Catcher in the Rye”, Holden Caulfield classifies many people as phonies. These people are primarily adults. The reason Holden calls adults phonies, rather than people his own age or younger, is because he has not yet experienced what adulthood is like and is afraid of what it may entail. I believe he calls people phonies because he will be less offended if they are to reject him in the future. In a sense, calling someone a phony is a way Holden puts up a wall to block anything that causes him to feel uncomfortable. He used the word phony when he went to the theatre. In chapter 16, Holden said, “…I hate actors. They never act like people. They just think they do, in a very slight way, but not in a way that’s fun to watch. And if an actor’s really good, you can always tell he knows he’s good and that spoils it. …I keep worrying about whether he’s going to do something phony every minute.” I believe Holden called the actors phony because he doesn’t realize that they are simply doing their jobs. Holden is quick to judge. He struggles in situations where he must trust others. Also, Holden’s brother, D. B., writes for movies and Holden is jealous of him. I think Holden used the word phony in this setting as an excuse to let out his true feelings for his brother. Holden calls people phonies so he can dismiss himself from social interactions. The use of the word phony by Holden is evidence that he has not matured and can’t accept people that are more accomplished than him.
ReplyDeleteEver since the beginning of the book Holden has a certain perception of adults or even people just a few years older than him. He basically thinks they are all phonies. The term “phony” has come up in the book a large number of times. For example some people he called phony were the principal at Pencey Prep, Stradlater, Ernie (the piano player at the nightclub), ministers, and Carl Luce. These are all people who are either adults or are older than Holden. In class we brought up a scene that I think ties in with this “adults are phony” topic. It is the scene where Holden is walking behind a young boy whose parents aren’t paying close attention to him and the boy starts singing these words, “If a body catch a body coming through the rye.” The boy would sing this over and over as he walked and Holden said it made him feel happy. When we discussed it in class it was said that it connects with the title and we inferred Holden feels like he is the catcher in the rye saving people from falling over. On a deeper level this means he feels he is saving young innocent people from becoming phony adults and helping them stay pure. This can also be a reason on why he was so upset with Stradlater when he went on the date with Jane because he must have felt that Jane was pure and innocent and that Stradlater took that away from her. When Holden considers someone a phony I think it just means he has a sort of hatred for adults. I think his hatred for adults could tie into the fact that he seems to not know how to move on and make positive changes in his life. I think he has a fear of adulthood because adults are classified in his mind as phonies. He’s afraid of becoming a phony. I also think this is messing with his life and he is in danger of being alone as he grows older. I say this because he is pushing everyone away due to the fact that he considers them all phonies.
ReplyDeleteIn the novel The Catcher In The Rye by J.D. Salinger the character Holden has repeatedly referred to adults as phonies from the beginning of the novel. Holden continues to refer to them as the novel goes on. For example, Holden refers to an adult, the headmaster, as a phony many times. An example is when Holden states, “One of the biggest reasons I left Elkton Hills was because I was surrounded by phonies. That's all. They were coming in the goddam window. For instance, they had this headmaster, Mr. Haas, that was the phoniest bastard I ever met in my life.” In this specific quote he refers to not only the headmaster but to all of Elkton Hills as phonies. His obsession with using this terms for adults is strange. I think that there's definitely a reason why Holden refers to adults phonies. Holden is most likely self conscious and jealous, by calling people phonies this hides his true feelings about them and he makes the adults seem like they are not as good as people think they are. By making other people look bad it makes himself feel better. As the reader I would like to see Holden stop being so negative and reach out to people. But in order for Holden to change he needs to change his ways. Holden needs to stop criticizing, he needs to express his feelings and thoughts to people, I think that would help him become a more well rounded character.
ReplyDeleteIn “The Catcher in The Rye” Holden has this perception of all adults or even people that are older than him being “phony”. I think Holden is caught in an awkward spot in his life. He doesn't want to grow up, either that or he just doesn't know how. All the adults that try to help him and point him in the right direction he thinks are fake. He feels as though they don't know how he feels or his state even though they have already went through this before. I think that something must have made Holden feel this way about adults, It's not like he automatically just decided that all adults are phony. The idea of being “phony” or “not phony” is important to Holden and his story because it's about being fake and lying. Maybe Holden is actually the phony one because he is always “compelled to lie” like when he was on the train and instantly gave the lady the name of the school janitor.
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